Axle suggestions

[Kunker]

Well, after bouncing around ideas in my head, I finally realized that I'm not going to be able to build a rig from scratch for a number of years, I bit the bullet and picked up a built rig. It still needs some work, but it's got a good body and frame, and I'm pretty much done with rust repair.

It's an 85 CJ7...

The good:
- good body
- good frame
- 350 SBC swapped in
- 350 tranny
- NP 205 case
- nearly new 36" TSLs

The decent:
- trussed and locked AMC 20 with lockrite and 1-piece Alloy...

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[Root Moose]

How much power is your engine making? Do you know the engine code? Is it EFI or carb'ed? Do you plan to add lower gears?

Given it is hooked up to a TH350/NP205 I'm going to guess carbed and around 250 hp on a good day? If so...

Of your options I figure the path of least resistance is:

1.) get a narrow waggy front axle

2.) get some flat top knuckles (Ford or Chev) and get some nice steering on it at the same time.

3.) use Ford 5 on 5.5" hub/spindle assemblies - can't remember if this affects the brake selection or not, likely? I'm thinking it will change the WMS as well but am not certain which way (plus or minus).

IIRC this will put you at around 61" WMS-2-WMS which should be a good complement to the axle in the rear that you currently have. 1982 was the first year of wide track CJs? I think your rear axle is ~56" wide. A few inches wider in the front is a perfect complement to the rear axle width. 5" of difference is pushing it but worst case you can always add spacers to the rear axle. I'd keep the AMC 20 unless you were thinking about upgrading to a full case locker and different gears. Even then...it's really an alright axle.

Do some research on the above combination - don't take my numbers as gospel. I may be mis-remembering things.

In an ideal world where your free time is infinite, do the above but start with the Ford HP44 housing instead. You could dump that NP205 for a flipped Dana 300 to make your life easier regarding differential placement but you'd need to adapt the transfer case to the Turbo 350, which is more money of course.

If you decide to go the Scout II front axle route let me know. I have one you can have for $100.

FWIW, I've gotten parts together to build a ~63" wide front axle without any cutting: `77 F250 housing, Chev flat tops, Scout hub/spindle assemblies (5 on 5.5"). Yeah, the hubs are the weak link but with WARN Premium hubs, 33" tires and a RENIX 4.0 it'll be plenty strong for me. The math says 63", reality might be different. I need a drivers side differential housing so no cutting. Just another combination to ponder and possibly lead somewhere else.

$0.02

 

[Farm Boy]

Aren't 3.54s are a little tall for 36s??
Other than the fact that the AMC 20 is there already with a couple upgrades, are there any "Real" reasons to keep it? (I'm not familiar with how this axle compares to others)

Unless you are specifically trying to keep it narrow why not full width stuff?
D44 and 12 Bolt from a 1/2 ton GM
D44 and a 9" from a Ford, also get a Ford 205 to go with it.
If the 36s are 12.5 wide, they'll fit on a 8" rim which you may even be able to get with the axles.

Already having the SBC, and 36s, I'd look for a 1 Ton GM with the D60/14B combo, many have 4.10s some even with 4.56s and a rear Detroit.
While personally I don't like the idea, the calipers can be ground to clear 15" rims.

 

[Kunker]

How much power is your engine making? Do you know the engine code? Is it EFI or carb'ed? Do you plan to add lower gears?

250 is probably a good estimate - carbed 350.

Given it is hooked up to a TH350/NP205 I'm going to guess carbed and around 250 hp on a good day? If so...

Of your options I figure the path of least resistance is:

1.) get a narrow waggy front axle

2.) get some flat top knuckles (Ford or Chev) and get some nice steering on it at the same time.

3.) use Ford 5 on 5.5" hub/spindle assemblies - can't remember if this affects the brake selection or not, likely? I'm thinking it will change the WMS as well but am not certain which way (plus or minus).

Didn't think to use a Waggy axle with the Ford hub/spindle. Guess I'll have to hit the books on reading up about WMS to WMS on Waggy stuff.

Though if I were to cut down a Waggy a few inches, early Bronco stuff is a bit narrower still I think.

If you decide to go the Scout II front axle route let me know. I have one you can have for $100.

Any chance you'd consider a trade for those YJ springs I've got?

 

[Kunker]

Aren't 3.54s are a little tall for 36s??

Definitely, but no way I'm changing gears in the D30.

Other than the fact that the AMC 20 is there already with a couple upgrades, are there any "Real" reasons to keep it? (I'm not familiar with how this axle compares to others)

In doing some reading, the ring gear is a bit larger than the D44, the 2-piece shafts and the flexy housing were the big down side. Trussing the axle and throwing in 1-piece shafts puts it about the same as a D44.

Unless you are specifically trying to keep it narrow why not full width stuff?
D44 and 12 Bolt from a 1/2 ton GM
D44 and a 9" from a Ford, also get a Ford 205 to go with it.
If the 36s are 12.5 wide, they'll fit on a 8" rim which you may even be able to get with the axles.

Want to keep it street legal and low key, so I'd rather keep most of the rubber under the sheetmetal. So unless I go to H1's (or other large backspacing rims), it's going to be a bit on the wide side.

Already having the SBC, and 36s, I'd look for a 1 Ton GM with the D60/14B combo, many have 4.10s some even with 4.56s and a rear Detroit.
While personally I don't like the idea, the calipers can be ground to clear 15" rims.

I'd love to, but like you, I wouldn't want to grind the calipers, so new tires for 16"+ rims, and the width is still more than I'd like.

Honestly, the more I think about it, the more Waggy 44's front and rear seem to make sense. Any other good axle combos out there?

 

[Farm Boy]

Definitely, but no way I'm changing gears in the D30.

Don't blame you on that one
My point was mostly that there is the possibility of finding axles that already have suitbale gears.

For what it's worth, years ago I put a '79 Bronco D44 under a '95 GMC with GM 6 lug outers to match the rear 14B semi-float.
I used the Ford spindle/caliper/pads with GM hubs/bearings/rotors. Worked like a charm, put a hard 80,000km on the setup with zero problems

The Waggy 44s still be the way to go, I'm considering them for Lynne's YJ (along with several other options)

 

[Kunker]

The Waggy 44s still be the way to go, I'm considering them for Lynne's YJ (along with several other options)

That's what I was leaning towards, just wanted to see if the resident brains had any other suggestions that I might not have thought of.

Thanks all!

 

[Root Moose]

Yeah, Waggy is a good option. Do you want a high pinion front axle? That is the only caveat to going with the waggies front and rear.

Was there ever a driver's side drop transfer case that will bolt up to a TH350? If there was then swapping the front axle tube setup may make sense. I think I read about interchanging Dodge and GM NP205 parts to make a driver's side drop TH350 transfer case. I think you might be able to use a NP208...

I didn't notice the tires you listed in your first post. "Stupid heavy" tires like TSLs might make you think about bigger axles... C&C D60 rear (~63") and at least a HP D44 of some flavour might make sense. If you are entertaining doing both axles anyway...

JAT, $0.02, YMMV, etc.

 

[Farm Boy]

Was there ever a driver's side drop transfer case that will bolt up to a TH350? If there was then swapping the front axle tube setup may make sense. I think I read about interchanging Dodge and GM NP205 parts to make a driver's side drop TH350 transfer case. I think you might be able to use a NP208...

TH350s came with either the 203 or 205, not 100% sure about the 208 but I'm almost positive it can be mounted behind one. If this does bolt up, it's got a lower low-range and alot lighter due to the aluminum case also chain driven. Big downside is that they all had slip-yolk rear output, don't know if SYE is available or not. Isn't the 208 still passenger side?

I think you mean mixing Ford and GM parts, Dodge is same side as GM.
Should be an easy swap to put a Ford 205 in place of the GM one, just need to make sure the input splines match (or swap the GM input into the Ford case)

:beer:

 

[szabotage]

here's some info on mating a ford NP205 to a th350:

http://www.patooyee.com/350toford205/350toford205b.htm

some more info on other transfer case possibilities to put behind your th350

http://www.novak-adapt.com/knowledge/th350.htm

I don't think any of them listed are driver's side drop, but the D300 can always be clocked