Diesel in a TJ

[emuis]

This is a bit of a broad question as I really have not alot of experience in this, so bear with me.

I have a 97 TJ (6Cyl Sport editition). I was wondering if it is possible to goto a Diesel engine and if so what should I look at first, how much approx would it run me? The engine would have to be able to run Bio Diesel. I don't off road alot, but still having the torque avail would be important.

I'm curious to see peoples opinions on this.

Thanks

Erick

 

[Jason]

JeepKings.ca, member by the name "fitty" did the swap to a Cummins 4BT costing roughly 10,000$.

Overland Diesel did the work. http://www.overlanddiesel.com/71/1534.html

 

[Joust]

Thats a cool engine. Where can we find them in our area? that'd be a cool swap. I wanted a small Deisel that would fit in a Toyota but had given up.

 

[Mitko]

GOOD idea. you only need to find the right engine which is not easy. at all. the last generation Chrysler (Mercedes) engines are super, but you cant run grease/bio. plus they are way too complicated/not easy repairable
/expencive. there is a lot of Jeeps, mostly Cherokees and GC in Europe with 2.5 and 3.1 TD engines, they are using a VM diesel engine (crap IMO) and are assembled in Graz, Austria (yes, the city where California governer is born )

 

[Joust]

Thats a cool engine. Where can we find them in our area? that'd be a cool swap. I wanted a small Deisel that would fit in a Toyota but had given up.

I was referring to the Cummins 4BT

 

[Dirk]

VW 16 or 1.9 turbo are a common swapp. Even a TDi can be easily swapped, without all the electronics if you replace the injection pump drive sprocket with one from a non-TDI 1.9.

the 2.8 litre diesel found in Libertys have a small block Chrysler bolt pattern, so there is a good chance it would bolt right up to your Jeep bellhousing.

Also, I believe ANY diesel will run on Bio diesel. The only issue is rubber seals that could break down from the alcohol present in bio diesel.
There is a huge movement for meanstream availability of bio diesel, especially in Europe. Even in alot of US states you can buy, sometimes exclusively, B20. (20%bio/80% fosil diesel).
Any diesel will run on Veg or Bio, there may be powerloss, clogging of filters or breakdown of rubber seals, but it will run.

 

[Mitko]

Also, I believe ANY diesel will run on Bio diesel. The only issue is rubber seals that could break down from the alcohol present in bio diesel.
There is a huge movement for meanstream availability of bio diesel, especially in Europe. Even in alot of US states you can buy, sometimes exclusively, B20. (20%bio/80% fosil diesel).
Any diesel will run on Veg or Bio, there may be powerloss, clogging of filters or breakdown of rubber seals, but it will run.

diesel can run on pretty much everything, it is originally designed to run on coil powder. and rubber seals and hoses are just part of the problem - the easy fixable one. but the modern CRDI engines have a really hard time running on diesel fuel substitutes.
couple of mine buddies allready spent truck load of $$$ fixing the CRDI pumps, electronics, injectors and bunch of other stuff after running on bio/grease.

 

[Joust]

ok
Where can I find a Cummins 4BT?
nice size engine. Should jam nicely in my Toy.

 

[armybuck041]

I'm currently looking at the possibility of doing a military GM 6.2L & Turbo 400 swap into my TJ from a Surplus 1 1/4 Ton CUCV.

The 6.2L engine is only about 200lbs heavier than a 4L, and they are dimensionally almost exactly the same as a Small Block Chev 350, which can easily be made to fit.

The biggest bonus is that they don't require a computer, and have minimal electrical parts.

They don't exactly have the greatest reputation, but their weaknesses and fixes are well documented. It should have plenty of mojo for pushing a 4500lb Jeep around.

 

[Mitko]

ok
Where can I find a Cummins 4BT?
nice size engine. Should jam nicely in my Toy.

I dont know, but if they dont catch you when you get yours, pls take two

I'm currently looking at the possibility of doing a military GM 6.2L & Turbo 400 swap into my TJ from a Surplus 1 1/4 Ton CUCV.

The 6.2L engine is only about 200lbs heavier than a 4L, and they are dimensionally almost exactly the same as a Small Block Chev 350, which can easily be made to fit.

The biggest bonus is that they don't require a computer, and have minimal electrical parts.

They don't exactly have the greatest reputation, but their weaknesses and fixes are well documented. It should have plenty of mojo for pushing a 4500lb Jeep around.

can't consider this as a good idea - you are adding 200+ more pounds weight and decrease the power with hmm 40-50 Hp, eh

 

[armybuck041]

can't consider this as a good idea - you are adding 200+ more pounds weight and decrease the power with hmm 40-50 Hp, eh

Nah, the 6.2 will easily push a TJ around smartly. Besides I'm more interested in the grunt. I used to drive a CUCV Ambulance from time to time at work. It wasn't a race car, but was more than adequate for pushing that 8500lb beast around.

FWIW, i'd be interested in knowing the weight difference between a Cummins 4BT and a Chev 6.2

 

[armybuck041]

Nah, the 6.2 will easily push a TJ around smartly. Besides I'm more interested in the grunt. I used to drive a CUCV Ambulance from time to time at work. It wasn't a race car, but was more than adequate for pushing that 8500lb beast around.

FWIW, i'd be interested in knowing the weight difference between a Cummins 4BT and a Chev 6.2

CUCV 6.2L = 655lbs
Cummins 4BT = 750-800lbs depending on model, etc
Jeep 4.0L = 500ish lbs

 

[Mitko]

Nah, the 6.2 will easily push a TJ around smartly. Besides I'm more interested in the grunt. I used to drive a CUCV Ambulance from time to time at work. It wasn't a race car, but was more than adequate for pushing that 8500lb beast around.

FWIW, i'd be interested in knowing the weight difference between a Cummins 4BT and a Chev 6.2

I used to drive a lot of them, ambulance aswell in my past-past work - me being the only mechanic in 200 miles radius who can/know how to maintenance/work on them, so I know what they can and can't. try to start it on 20 below with dead aftermarket bateries, 7 burned glow plugs and jumping the glow plug relay with padlock ring and we can talk :smokin: (no offence, dont get me wrong, just experience)
4BT weights about 500 pounds, dunno about 6.2

 

[armybuck041]

I used to drive a lot of them, ambulance aswell in my past-past work - me being the only mechanic in 200 miles radius who can/know how to maintenance/work on them, so I know what they can and can't. try to start it on 20 below with dead aftermarket bateries, 7 burned glow plugs and jumping the glow plug relay with padlock ring and we can talk :smokin: (no offence, dont get me wrong, just experience)
4BT weights about 500 pounds, dunno about 6.2

Not gonna argue, i'm not a Mechanic.

Anyway, to each his own. Not telling anyone how it is, or which way to go.

What I can do, is get a reasonably low milage 6.2/Turbo 400 combo complete with Harness for less than a 4BT on its own. Like I said, its not without its flaws, but, it can be swapped in almost as easily as a Small Block Chev. That to me, makes it a cheap Diesel option. I'm cheap BTW

The 5 Cyl Mercedes in the our new G-Wagons would make a beautiful swap. Can't imagine the price tag or getting around all of the electronics on one of them mind you. I can vouch for their ability to run in uber-cold weather and digest shit fuel.

 

[Mitko]

The 5 Cyl Mercedes in the our new G-Wagons would make a beautiful swap. Can't imagine the price tag or getting around all of the electronics on one of them mind you. I can vouch for their ability to run in uber-cold weather and digest shit fuel.

here you put fingers in my deepest bloody wound . please stop

 

[Dirk]

Joust, why not find a Toyota 1KZ-TE which will bolt rigt up o your tranny?
There are several importers of halfcuts.

As for a Bio and common rail diesels goes, from what I have researched it seems to be a viscosity issue. Injectors in CR diesels run at higher pressures and Bio being somewhat thicker seems to be the issue. Which can lead to poor performance and rough running, due to fuel starvation. Common rail pumps have a lot fewer moving parts than traditional injection pumps and should experience less wear with dryer fuels. But, Bio has higher lubricity than fossil diesel.


If you gonna run Bio fuel, just google "common rail diesel biodiesel". Decide for yourself. There are always many factors to consider, and personally I feel that alot shops and mechanics are way too quick to blame Bio fuel for failures. Its an easy out for them. Ofcourse there is substandard biodiesel out there, commercial bio has to meet standards, EN590, DIN 51606 & EN14214, whereas homebrewed stuff could be anywhere from great to total crap.

Anyway, run the fuel you are confident in. :beer:

 

[Dirk]

I have seen hard cold starting issues with 6.2's aswell. Usually they go through glow plugs and batteries yearly.

And....the Benz diesel.....SWEET, wish i had a few around for swapps.

 

[Mitko]

yea, toyota's diesel is next best after Mercedes, and easier to find

 

[Farm Boy]

Thats a cool engine. Where can we find them in our area? that'd be a cool swap. I wanted a small Deisel that would fit in a Toyota but had given up.

Why not get a Yota deisel? Should be an easy swap depending on what Yota you have. Cruisers have had various types and you could get them in the trucks for a few years too.

 

[Joust]

couldn't find one.
I'll keep lookin.
I'm not in a rush, thats for sure. The old 22re needs a head gasket though.